
When it comes to rap though, which is so much about "representation" and "authenticity" and all this other stuff, it's hard to not reduce someone like Gucci Mane to a symbol. For rap fans of a certain type, he represents the antithesis to the current "underground" scene, or such a change from rappers of equal fame to Gucci's fifteen years ago or whatever else that they can't help but get upset.
This devolves into an issue of sensibility and taste--what we want, expect, celebrate, enjoy from rap starkly contrasted in say, Elzhi (or your favorite, nimble, lyrical rapper) vs. Gucci Mane. This is at first, reasonable as yeah, Elzhi and Gucci from a pretty conventional point of view don't share a lot in common. Of course they actually do, and an ongoing enterprise in and of itself's begun that seeks to disentangle the many ways in which Gucci's very much "lyrical".

These days, unemployed and needing to feel like I'm doing something with my life, I walk to the local university library--about a 3.5 mile walk--to write these goofy screeds (and those by me elsewhere). Of the many edifying results of walking a long-ass way on the daily is growing especially intimate with the music on my iPod.
At least half of this walk is spent everyday with Diamond District's In the Ruff and some mix of Gucci tracks, sometimes nerdy "favorite songs" playlists, and most often one of his many mixtapes. Both Diamond District and Gucci are perfect walking music, filled with enough menace and glee, and closed-off, staccatto, word-obsessive rapping to keep me entertained.
Like In the Ruff (or Enta Da Stage or Hard to Earn or whatever), say From Zone 6 to Duval, is non-stop cluttered rapping, that's hard to gulp down all at once--either locking in on your brain and taking up all your time, or effortlessly falling to the wayside like background music. Again with the 90s New York rap comparisons--Gucci's approach to money, dealing drugs, or fucking girls has the abstract but material feel of slang-obsessed insanity from Cuban Linx.

The same way say, us white boys cringe when Lil Wayne straps on a guitar and makes some butt rock because it reminds us of the turd metal listened to by the football players who stuffed us in lockers or the AC/DC blasted by our drunk step-dad as he drove us to high school when we missed the bus (that's to say, it's a bit deeper than the music just sucking to our ears), do I get the sense that guys like Gucci, a drawling, slurring, convicted of a crime a couple times rapper, represents a lot of negative shit to black listeners. When Gucci's just floating around on the radio or blog he's fine, but when people like me and others celebrate the dude's work it strikes a certain chord of frustration.
The dislike of Gucci, when it extends beyond aesthetic reasons (which are I feel at this point, a waste to debate, the evidence is insurmountable that the guy's got something interesting going on), falls into what Gucci's a symbol of or for. Reducing anything and especially anybody to a symbol is always a problem though. It removes all the tiny details and humanity of that person, and turns them into something for every and anybody to project whatever onto the subject at-hand.

That Gucci's delivery, his way of speaking, continues to be a target seems especially depressing and sadly "high-school", especially after that Creative Loafing article, which revealed that these were the kinds of problems Gucci's dealt with since he was 9 years old:
"I got [picked on] because of how I spoke and my diction, which was different," he says. "I would talk with a country slang because I was from Alabama." Nonetheless he excelled in his classes, not so much because he studied a lot but because of his God-given abilities. "I was always naturally smart," he boasts. "I had a high IQ.""
On "Neva Had Shit" off a ton of mixtapes and the unofficial, official Murder Was the Case, Gucci details some of this not adversity, but extreme version of the kind of bullshit any kid that's a little different has to fuck with...mentioning "rich kids at school" making fun of him, and tossing-in a matter-of-fact aside: "Teachers say that we can't talk". It's the matter-of-fact tone that's key here, because it's Gucci diving into the coping mechanism/not-smart-enough-to-get-injustice that every kid has at the age of nine when they gotta deal with some heavy shit. A mix of innocent curiosity and just not knowing when to shut the fuck up: "Grandaddy why your eyes so goddamn red?/Got a real soft-ass and hard-ass head/Better mind your fuckin manners boy, that's what he said".
As "Neva Had Shit" continues, Gucci's formative years--like Wayne, Gucci is obsessed with his youth and how it's shaped him--full of peaks and valleys, a step-dad (who'll turn out to be an alcoholic in verse three), noted and success trapping, are fully detailed. There's a continued sense of rise and fall in the song, matching the horns of the beat, as Gucci slowly grasps the awful ups and downs (often at the same time) of life. The double-bind of love and life is perfectly captured in Gucci's explanation of the relationship between his mom and stepdad (whom he just calls dad): "Now, my daddy hustle hard but he love some liquor/And my momma wanna leave him but she love that nigga". The next line, "Everything kinda change when I turn 16" both speaks to the unfortunate stuff he just described and the next line, which solidifies his success in the dope game by way of an "old-school regal". This is a song about growing up surrounded by upheaval--a minor victory in one part of your life, a big, ugly disaster somewhere else--and how that's how it goes, forever, or what feels like forever when you're fourteen.
This is Gucci at his most lucid, his most direct and confessional--do you get more direct than the hook to "Neva Had Shit"?--and while this is not his usual stance as a rapper, he peppers in this sort stuff enough that I tell anybody who claims Gucci doesn't rap about anything to fuck off.

Though the two really don't have a whole lot in common, Gucci's the logical step after Lil Wayne in terms of delivering a non-traditional (though not post-lyrical) form of lyricism that gets people to take note of writing. Getting people who still buy CDs or have quick access to a mixtape spot, the old style of rap fan or even rap nerd and just regular rap listener--the one not Videodrome-d to their internet connection--to obsess over lines and craft and all that is no easy feat. The same way Lil Wayne transcended "hood" stuff by stretching it into meaning a lot and nothing, Gucci has.
Two white dudes with a Mastiff standing outside a convenience store bumping a Gucci tape and grinning, verbally guffawing even, when Gucci says something nutty. Regular ass eleventh-graders before my A.P English class I taught, parsing-out Wayne's half-baked, maybe awesomely over-baked similes. A car speeds by and some Zaytoven joint is blasting out of the car speakers--this happens a few times a week.

People don't so much have favorite Gucci Mane songs as they do Gucci Mane mixtapes. It's in part because there's so many songs and so many mixtapes, but it's also because Gucci's rolls through every beat, every song, every tape with the something resembling the same aplomb. He crawls inside the beat and reforms it to fit his own rap skin.
When the wonky beat of "Hurry" (off the recent Writing on the Wall) begins, the focus is the super-identifiable doot-doot-doot circus song, but by the middle, Gucci's bouncing a shit-ton of words that end in long E off one another ("thirsty/ early/ lovely/ me/ hurry/ jury/ emergency/ currency/ burglaried"), like in the song's title "Hurry", even ending the verse, continuing the long E obsession through the chorus, and holding on for the next verse's first few lines, then abandoning it for another game of vowel-sound matching, all to the rhythm of the snapping, tinny drums--that circus part's pushed to the background. He's not so much versatile as he is elastic, stretching his voice and rap-joy across whatever beat's placed in front of him. That he can fall back on occasion, to the stuff he addresses soberly on "Neva Had Shit", in effect "proving" he can do regular old rap songs, adds enough levity to the songs to make them "matter", if it's important to you that songs "matter".

"guys like Gucci, a drawling, slurring, convicted of a crime a couple times rapper, represents a lot of negative shit to black listeners."
ReplyDeleteMy favorite line in the review. And while Gucci does seem to represent a lot of negative shit (even though its largely perceived from people that wouldn't bother to pick up one of his mixtapes) the bigger problem for me is the "worker bee output". Rapping on a million different beats of varying quality and putting out monthly/quarterly mixtapes and an album a year doesn't track with me as much as a thoughtful, theme driven or even sonically coherent album every year or two with maybe a mixtape here and there.
The issue for me when I say something like "this mid 90's rapper/current underground rapper is better than popular rapper x" isn't so much content as it is quality and focus of the projects. Dropping x amount of mixtapes and then putting out a weak album isn't impressive and dilutes the album of much (if any) of its significants.
Aside: I must admit that within the last 5 years, the albums from "southern" artist tend to be some of the most sonically cohesive when put up against their northern/western/midwestern counterparts (glaring exception: lil wayne)
If we are ever to get over that hill and find our way to a more enlightened post-'no homo' era in rap blogging, you're going to have to be at least self-conscious enough to not post multiple shirtless pics of a male rapper while talking about the "invigorating feeling" he gives you.
ReplyDeleteI think that's part of the joke, Al.
ReplyDeleteLOLZ. Sometimes I think the simple act of describing something's kinda fruity, no? Glad I got rid of the part where I described Gucci's music as "boner-inducing".
ReplyDeleteYeah... adjectives are pretty gay, if you think about it.
ReplyDeleteEnjoy whatever music moves you.
ReplyDeleteBut how is it not borderline racist for writers to use a fetish for the new, for the non-East coast, for the non "golden era," for black (ghetto) authenticity to gush over the intelligence of black rappers these writers don't really believe to be intelligent?
This whole line sounds suspiciously like "He's so articulate; he speaks so well!" whether it comes from Whitey McNeckbeard or Michael Eric Dyson.
And, come on, how are you gonna get on people about a lack of nuance when you depict those who don't recognize the supposed genius of Gucci as "lyrically lyrical" type who worships at the altar of Elzhi?
Gordon-
ReplyDeleteI'm confused where I mentioned anything about black authenticity myself. I invoked it sure, but namely because, this sort of (ultimately) silly issue contextualize Gucci before he even speaks. I don't think I've read anything by any blogger of note about Gucci that deals with authenticity or "hood"-ness at all. I think the interesting thing about Gucci love vs Wayne love is how he's being discussed in connection with conventional lyricists in many ways. He's not being celebrated for being "unhinged" or "odd" or whatever...a la Wayne.
Even his prolific output (this touches on Fernando's point too) is more in conjunction with his staggering consistency and singular aesthetic than some suggestion that he's say, Lil Wayne or I don't know, Basquait, in terms of some off-the-rails, oh-so-expressive whatever whatever, you know?
In short, I feel like you're projecting an old argument onto another guy and in this case, the praise seems especially absent of that kind of stuff.
Well, critics clearly aren't going to own up to it, even if they're aware of it.
ReplyDeleteFrom the segment of critics in question, (black) hoodness is a requirement for the rappers to receive praise for being articulate.
Critics wouldn't be harping on Gucci's intelligent writing and love of language if he were perceived to be a middle class black dude. Remember the "Wayne is really smart; he's taking college courses and everything!" angle?
Their intentions are noble, I guess. They are attempting to counter the idea that all shirtless, grilled, thick-drawled Southern hood rappers are coonish morons.
That doesn't change the fact that it's disingenuous and condescending to the rappers. And yeah, it's racialized in a problematic way.
I'm not projecting a played out argument where it doesn't fit; I'm pointing out an uncomfortable but ever-present reality. It's not like this stuff can be wished away via post-racial fantasies.
I understand why fans of the genre are excited about Gucci, but they're reaching hard with their lyrical analyses, and in a patronizing, quasi-racist way that doesn't help anybody.
Great post.
ReplyDeleteMost of all, I'm struck at the fact that the dude is even popular at all. I remember you were one of the first people I started hearing mentions of the guy and I never thought much of it (I'm pretty done with rap out of frustration with diminishing returns and the fact that next to DOOM, the most consistent rap album I heard all year was by fucking Rick Raw$e, so I 've been skipping nearly every suggested artist to come from rap blogs) but somehow early this Spring I copped (por gratis) "Back to the Traphouse" and got kinda converted.
Still, even though I, with my late pass, hopped on the bandwagon and bump the first 5 or so tracks on that LP regularly, I don't get how he's become the forerunner with Drake as "The Next Big Shit in Rap". I'm searching for signifiers of what this might represent in a world where Lil' Wayne has become passe and his hype-bubble predictably burst from over-exposure and all around Wu-Tang/Dip Set style bullshit rap promises of projects that never get released.
Gordon- To be fair, (as a flip to the whole "This jigaboo can pronounce polysyllabic words decent enough!" thing) I'm shocked whenever Mos Def says anything remotely articulate or intelligent. Mostly because I've become accustomed to undie and/or conscious types to be well-spoken retards, with the public Mos of the last few years being a fine example.
ReplyDeleteGordon-
ReplyDeleteDo you think that's what me, or Noz, or David and the Shrimp crew are doing?
I also feel like the reason there's a certain level of defense or attempt to legitimize Gucci is not because I think he's "smart for a dumb Southern rapper" but because people like you are telling ME that I'm treating him like's a smart for a dumb Southern rapper rapper when I'm basically breaking down his lyrics the way I would with anything.
I feel kind of frustrated by your response here because you're not explaining to me how any of the stuff you're accusing people of is manifest.
Also, I think people are reaching way less with Gucci than even Wayne--everyone's doing like, hard, "close-reading" style breakdowns.
Christopher-
ReplyDeleteThere's SO MUCH good rap out this year, I'm surprised you feel the way you do...DJ Paul/Juicy J/Project Pat release, Rhymefest mixtape, Quik/Kurupt, Diamond District, New Mos Def is good, Gucci's 'Murder was the Case' is good (and mixtapes, especially 'Gucci Land', UGK, DOOM, Cam'ron, Kneel Knaris 'Going Sane in a Crazy World', 5 O'Clock Shadowboxers...
I've been digging the Blaqkout record so far. I think the problem is that I had no idea about half of the records you listed, except Mos and Cam who I've given listen but haven't sat down with in order to avoid disappointment. Although the good tracks on "Public Enemy No. 1" I loves so Crime Pays shouldn't be too much of a let down.
ReplyDeleteI usually end up shit-talking the year's releases and play catch up in the 4th quarter anyway.
The same reason I haven't checked out or even heard of half these albums is prolly the same reason I stopped blogging, in a way.
please stop
ReplyDeleteI agree Anonymous, Gordon should really stop.
ReplyDeleteOk so I've been wanting to pussyfoot around this for a bit. Basically the problem with praising Gucci for having a wide vocabulary in the sense that Noz used is that rappers are SUPPOSED to have wide vocabularies, especially if most of what they do is rhyme about the same few topics. If a rapper can't find a new or different way to say the same thing, that rapper is worthless.
ReplyDeleteAnother thing is that sometimes you and often Noz like to praise "dumb" rappers for their "smart" characteristics and "smart" rappers for their "dumb" characteristics (yeah I know, the quotes are insufferable, but that's kinda how this blog works, right? Also I've done this myself so I'm not just finger-pointing.)While this allows for a lot of subtler points or more insights to come across, it just looks weird when Noz is praising Gucci's vocabulary and not Pharoahe Monch's, and coupling that with saying that De La Soul are at their best making super-elaborate dick jokes. Or if you think being super-lyrical like Elzhi is so great or worth celebrating, why don't you write about him or praise him as much as Gucci? (This is actually something I'd be interested in, cuz didn't you think Detroit Deli was a new classic or something?)
Lastly, Gordon can speak for himself, but I didn't get any sense from his comments of looking to dismiss Gucci or turn him into a symbol, more that he had a problem with the way the praise was articulated. I think you're trying to turn his argument into something it's not or a dumber version of what it is, which is pretty ironic considering what all this junk is about.
Jordan-
ReplyDeleteOf course, it would be great if Gordon said any of the things you've said. I still don't think he's addressing any of the things actually said about Gucci and it reads more like the same argument repeated for Wayne two summers ago and Jeezy a summer before that and Jay-Z when I was middle school and a lot of people told me he was a clown...
One thing, I shouldn't speak for Noz because a)I just shouldn't and b) He'll just tell me whatever I say/suggest is wrong but...I think everyone's mis-categorizing Noz's "vocabulary" thing in that it's Gucci, sitting down and thinking of especially bizarre and out of the box in terms of his sub-genre ways to express shit.
It isn't "Wow, such a grill-wearing negro says kinda smart things". It's a nuanced argument beyond simple "wow big vocabulary" but rather how and why that vocab's being employed.
I praised Kanye for his breakdown of the multiple ways he uses the word "Cold" on '808s': Cold as bad, cold as good/awesome, etc. etc. It isn't that Kanye is a genius but that he's messing with words towards an interesting plurality of meaning and blah blah blah...
In short, you're reducing the argument to make Noz look silly, which is a play straight out of Noz's book when he disagrees with people.
Moving on, I think that the only reason me or Noz or whoever else feel the need to flip the "smart"/"dumb" divide is because people like Gordon or you Jordan here are setting that divide up. If I didn't KNOW that my point would be derailed by whoever when I praise 3-6, I wouldn't address the divide.
Again, can't speak for Noz, but I just prefer work that's not as self-consciously "smart" or mannered. Same reason I don't like Bergman films or novels by Barthelme or why I think Frank Norris has more to say about the human condition than Henry James. You smell me?
'Detroit Deli' is a great album, less because Elzhi is real lyrical and shit, and more because Slum talk a lot of real shit about um...one of the members going mental and the band being all confused, etc etc.
Go through the 400 entries here, there's plenty of close-reading lyrics of "smart" rappers too, so chill on that...
Haha, I feel like Gordon started out on the right track then kinda fell off? I guess I'm picking up where I last felt he had a point. Also I was trying not to misinterpret Noz's point, I think I'd agree it's pretty subtle and nuanced, but even with that reading it's still what rappers are SUPPOSED to do. That said praising Monch for his vocabulary would be pretty dumb, he's so far out there in what he's talking about that there's not much precedent in terms of language.
ReplyDeleteI didn't look back through the archives, but I've been reading pretty much every post since mid 2007, and had a tough time thinking of examples of close readings of "smart" rappers, last one that really made an impression was comeback Andre 3k. But that could be from a few things, like you doing less close reading posts recently, or maybe just "smart" rappers not really stepping their game up? I'll chill on that, sure. Just, like, you'd be better off if you were a bit less defensive, genuinely examined your taste* instead of saying how many posts you've written to intimidate people into backing down. (This also goes for me, Noz, Gordon, everyone else on the internet w/ an opinion)
I totally get your explanation for why you feel the need to address the divide, but at the same time I feel like you're only perpetuating that divide by doing so. Not that perceptions will go away if you don't or anything. Probably the worst solution except for all the others.
*I know you did that here also, and that's pretty cool, one of the reasons I posted this here is that I knew I'd get a long real discussion out of you and probably couldn't w/anyone else.
Jordan-
ReplyDeleteI miss long discussions on this blog. I'm sure its in part because my writing's been pretty bad for awhile now on here, but yeah, let's keep it up. I think that for me especially, I don't think my perspective on Gucci is notably different than my perspective on other stuff, but yeah, certainly telling you to chill is a bullshit way of addressing it.
That said, in one way or another my 'How Big' posts are brief rap close readings sometimes and those are not relegated to "dumb" rappers.
The issue with not addressing the divide is its like an elephant in the room thing. Like to not address what so many will clearly mention seems weird?
Ultimately though for me, it's an issue of taste, as I said Norris over James or Mean Streets over Goodfellas or whatever...
Moving on, I'd agree Gordon had a point and please pick it up since he's not willing to have a discussion. Monch vs Gucci, clearly "absurd" but also, Gucci has this odd mix of on-the-ground Southern rap literalism and weird word-stretching fun that's just really engaging, especially right now for many reasons. Just more to discuss, figure out, celebrate in some ways.
The other issue with the opposition to Gucci is its often presented as some kind of contrived "stance" when for me at least, it's more me, in words, working out my reaction to shit I like.
Hence, my point that Gucci and Diamond District give me the same feeling. All I know is I walk around or drive listening to Gucci and it makes me feel all kinds of ways. I'm not walking around like "Man this is sooo HOOOD" or "Man, he's so smart for a grill-wearing moron"...
Come on, man. I'm always willing to have a discussion. It's kind of hard to participate when I'm on vacation, though.
ReplyDeleteJordan did a decent job of picking up the thread (especially the part where he questions rappers getting praise for shit they're supposed to do), but the race and class stuff is more central to my concerns than you all are letting on.
I think it's almost always phony, exploitative, and condescending when educated people read "intelligence" into the works of relatively uneducated and/or poor people, whether it's an artfags (pardon the term) praising outsider art or music critics praising LCD rap as "surprisingly smart." The racial aspect makes it even more disgusting.
It's obvious that you all genuinely like Gucci and that the "intelligent lyrics"/large vocabulary" angle isn't driving your praise. But I think that you all are tolerating or cosigning this bunk angle precisely because you like him and want to give him as much praise as possible.
Ask yourselves this: Why has no one has felt the need to use this approach to praising the (s)language loving rappers of the past? Why does this seem to be a phenomenon limited to praise of contemporary Southern dope boys (and maybe Camron)?
I'm working on a longer post about the source of my issues with this. A lot of it has to do with 1) my difficulty as both a rap fan and someone sensitive to fucked up minstrel-like depictions of black people and 2) the near bankruptcy of current popular and academic rap criticism.
Gordon-
ReplyDeleteReally, whose vacation doesn't include the internets still?? Just joking--
I know you know this and I know you know I know this--that's why I say you're not really discussing it--but I really can't agree with you on the "uneducated" thing. I never think of Gucci's music from that perspective and if you read up he got good grades, got scholarships, attended college etc. My guess is his GPA was better than mine.
Of course, I can see why people think of him as "dumb" but he isn't.
Also, there's plenty of people discussing rappers' lyrics and always have been. I like what I like and that's all this blog is, my biases are there pretty loud and clear, but they certainly don't gravitate towards the strictly "Dumb". In this piece I compare Gucci's mixtapes to Diamond District which is conventionally "smart" rap--it's also very, very good.
Jayson Green stumbled into this mistake over at Noz's--there's a couple of us who all seem to have been into Gucci and thinking about him and we're now commenting on it. In terms of the media, he's there because PEOPLE, not WRITERS, like him. Been driving around Baltimore a lot this week doing interviews for a piece I'm writing and hear Gucci coming out of cars all the time...something I didn't hear as much with Wayne's mixtape tracks (though The Carter 3 was ubiquitous anywhere in my city last summer).
I think as I said before, Cam or Wayne or whoever get a lot of write-ups because there's opposition to them. Because the minute something's praised that YOU consider "ignorant", you lob out "racist" and stuff...well, writers sorta have to combat that and it often manifests itself in deeper, thoughtful writing...which you (and others obviously) then also criticize. You're encouraging us basically.
"I think it's almost always phony, exploitative, and condescending when educated people read "intelligence" into the works of relatively uneducated and/or poor people, whether it's an artfags (pardon the term) praising outsider art or music critics praising LCD rap as "surprisingly smart." The racial aspect makes it even more disgusting.
ReplyDeleteIt's obvious that you all genuinely like Gucci and that the "intelligent lyrics"/large vocabulary" angle isn't driving your praise. But I think that you all are tolerating or cosigning this bunk angle precisely because you like him and want to give him as much praise as possible."
I can see where you're coming from on this but I dont really think anyone has done that. I think its obvious that Gucci's slurred delivery (intentionally? unintentionally? does it matter?) disguises how smart what hes saying is -- and i dont mean 'smart' in any way except "expanding the canvas of a rapper's ability to express himself" which I truly believe he has done. i dont know what his GPA is or his grades & i know he has some dumb-ass opinions on women but as a rapper, he's taken a really genuinely new & creative path.
I dont even get why we should be comparing pharoahe, as if his rap style is automatically more interesting just bcuz it happens to come across as 'smarter.' he hasnt changed up his style in ages -- if it was '94 & gucci and pharoahe were both dropping some of their best shit simultaneously, maybe the comparison would be arguable, but why the fuck would i still be on pharoahes dick in '09?? Gucci is doing some genuinely new shit right now with rap, purely on a formalist level
It isn't "Wow, such a grill-wearing negro says kinda smart things". It's a nuanced argument beyond simple "wow big vocabulary" but rather how and why that vocab's being employed.
ReplyDeleteI wish more people would re-read that and really think about the praise that is being directed at Gucci. Do you really think Gucci-backers are dumb enough to actually be impressed by the breadth of Gucci's vocabulary? What impresses us is the words and phrases he selects and how he employs them. It's the effortlessness in which he seems to produce these lyrical devices that are foreign to a genre which we love that keeps us punch-drunk and wanting more, not thoughts of Gucci secretly getting a 5 on his AP English exam.
From forever ago, but feel like going back to this for a second---
ReplyDeleteI only invoked Gucci's actual education because of Gordon's continued mentions of smartness or lack there of, stretching it to say "relatively uneducated". The point in mentioning Gucci's high school career--which mind you IS documented in the Creative Loafing article--is to point out that dude, you can't get at Gucci on that front...
GUUUCCI
ReplyDeleteit's 15 minutes past the diamond bitch!
ReplyDelete